more (as if we needed it -

since NOTHING is going to be done) on the savagery we have perpetrated. yes, even on innocents (yes, some were terrorists, but SOME ARE INNOCENT). no matter what, torture as a rule DOESN'T WORK. if and that's a BIG IF people 'talk' because they are being tortured, chances are they are going to spew what they think YOU want to hear.

we are human beings. we have laws in place. we cannot turn our backs on the laws nor can we revert back to terrorism ourselves. we MUST STOP THIS AND WE MUST PUNISH THOSE WHO ARE GUILTY. and by those i don't mean some private or corporal somewhere. i mean the bush kingdom. all of 'em. they should be brought up on charges immediately and punished accordingly (lock them up forever and throw away the key)
CIA Played Larger Role In Advising Pentagon
Harsh Interrogation Methods Defended
By Joby Warrick
Washington Post Staff Writer

A senior CIA lawyer advised Pentagon officials about the use of harsh interrogation techniques on detainees at Guantanamo Bay in a meeting in late 2002, defending waterboarding and other methods as permissible despite U.S. and international laws banning torture, according to documents released yesterday by congressional investigators.

Torture "is basically subject to perception," CIA counterterrorism lawyer Jonathan Fredman told a group of military and intelligence officials gathered at the U.S.-run detention camp in Cuba on Oct. 2, 2002, according to minutes of the meeting. "If the detainee dies, you're doing it wrong."

The document, one of two dozen released by a Senate panel investigating how Pentagon officials developed the controversial interrogation program introduced at Guantanamo Bay in late 2002, suggests a larger CIA role in advising Defense Department interrogators than was previously known. By the time of the meeting, the CIA already had used waterboarding, which simulates drowning, on at least one terrorism suspect and was holding high-level al-Qaeda detainees in secret prisons overseas -- actions that Bush administration lawyers had approved.

The new evidence, along with hours of questioning of former Pentagon officials at a hearing of the Senate Armed Services Committee yesterday, shed light on efforts by top aides to then-Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld to research and reverse-engineer techniques used by military survival schools to prepare U.S. service members for possible capture by hostile forces. ..........